[Mojolicious] Stable version to upgrade to

Discussion:

Ganesh Udupa

2018-10-24 02:54:56 UTC

Hi,
We are currently at 5.28. Can someone recommend a stable latest version to
upgrade to?. Is 8.04 stable?

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to mojolicious+***@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to ***@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Stefan Adams

2018-10-24 03:24:34 UTC

Permalink

Define "stable". The latest release is stable in that it works well and
passes all tests (thousands of them). It's not "stable" in the sense that
the 8.0 release is constantly changing and improving from minor release to
minor release, but that should be expected.

The core team works very hard to not include any breaking changes within a
major version code base, and their excellent tests help validate that.
Watch the change log. They label new things that aren't "stable" in terms
of API or even longevity as experimental and production deployments are
encouraged to avoid those features. Things that will be removed in a future
major version are labeled as deprecated.

Hmm... One thing: I think I recall that deprecations can occur within a
time frame (3 months IIRC) as opposed to being limited to at the next major
release. Don't quote me on that. If that were the case, using the last
release of the prior major release might be the most stable? If I made that
up, you should absolutely always be able to use the most recent release of
the current major -- just avoid experimental.

Core team: my apologies if I added any unacceptable confusion.

Post by Ganesh Udupa
Hi,
We are currently at 5.28. Can someone recommend a stable latest version
to upgrade to?. Is 8.04 stable?
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Ganesh Udupa

2018-10-24 03:44:11 UTC

Permalink

Thanks for the quick response. I appreciate. The reason I asked is that I
saw multiple minor updates in 8.x in a short period. ( I dont know if this
is how it was in older major versions )
Is the last release of 7.x a better option (thanks for that comment) or
should I use 8.04?

Post by Stefan Adams
Define "stable". The latest release is stable in that it works well and
passes all tests (thousands of them). It's not "stable" in the sense that
the 8.0 release is constantly changing and improving from minor release to
minor release, but that should be expected.
The core team works very hard to not include any breaking changes within a
major version code base, and their excellent tests help validate that.
Watch the change log. They label new things that aren't "stable" in terms
of API or even longevity as experimental and production deployments are
encouraged to avoid those features. Things that will be removed in a future
major version are labeled as deprecated.
Hmm... One thing: I think I recall that deprecations can occur within a
time frame (3 months IIRC) as opposed to being limited to at the next major
release. Don't quote me on that. If that were the case, using the last
release of the prior major release might be the most stable? If I made that
up, you should absolutely always be able to use the most recent release of
the current major -- just avoid experimental.
Core team: my apologies if I added any unacceptable confusion.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Stefan Adams

2018-10-24 03:58:28 UTC

Permalink

Post by Ganesh Udupa
Thanks for the quick response. I appreciate. The reason I asked is that I
saw multiple minor updates in 8.x in a short period. ( I dont know if this
is how it was in older major versions )

In my experience this is very normal, and IMO exciting!

Is the last release of 7.x a better option (thanks for that comment) or

Post by Ganesh Udupa
should I use 8.04?

IMO and based on the feedback that I see frequently from the core Dev team:
always run the latest release. However, maybe I've drawn that conclusion
too far. Perhaps they only expect that with respect to submitting bug
reports. i.e. if you are running the latest 7.x and want to report a bug,
first validate that it is still a bug in the latest 8.x release, because if
it isn't, the bug has already been identified and patched.

The last 7.x release is super stable, but it doesn't have and won't get
some of the awesome new features going into 8.x. But if you want "stable"
you won't want to use them yet anyway. However, security fixes and bug
fixes go into the current major release. There is no parallel code base
maintenance, it's just a continuous singular stream. Therefore, a "solid"
strategy to stand still at the last prior major version is probably a bad
idea: bugs won't get patched and worse security holes will forever be
security holes.

TL;DR I *think* everyone would agree to always use the most current release
of the current major. Just "follow the rules" and avoid experimental.

I would like to get clarification tho on mid-major deprecation removals. If
you keep your production systems always running the latest release and then
deprecations occur before your production code has had a chance to pass
through your org's process, that could be bad news.

Post by Ganesh Udupa

Post by Stefan Adams
Define "stable". The latest release is stable in that it works well and
passes all tests (thousands of them). It's not "stable" in the sense that
the 8.0 release is constantly changing and improving from minor release to
minor release, but that should be expected.
The core team works very hard to not include any breaking changes within
a major version code base, and their excellent tests help validate that.
Watch the change log. They label new things that aren't "stable" in terms
of API or even longevity as experimental and production deployments are
encouraged to avoid those features. Things that will be removed in a future
major version are labeled as deprecated.
Hmm... One thing: I think I recall that deprecations can occur within a
time frame (3 months IIRC) as opposed to being limited to at the next major
release. Don't quote me on that. If that were the case, using the last
release of the prior major release might be the most stable? If I made that
up, you should absolutely always be able to use the most recent release of
the current major -- just avoid experimental.
Core team: my apologies if I added any unacceptable confusion.

Post by Ganesh Udupa
Hi,
We are currently at 5.28. Can someone recommend a stable latest version
to upgrade to?. Is 8.04 stable?
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Dan Book

2018-10-24 06:51:30 UTC

Permalink

Yes, there is no reason to run an older release. Yes, there is a danger to
blindly updating, it's recommended to manage all your CPAN dependencies
(not just Mojolicious) with Carton to pin versions if this is a concern.

-Dan

Post by Stefan Adams

In my experience this is very normal, and IMO exciting!
Is the last release of 7.x a better option (thanks for that comment) or

Post by Ganesh Udupa
should I use 8.04?

IMO and based on the feedback that I see frequently from the core Dev
team: always run the latest release. However, maybe I've drawn that
conclusion too far. Perhaps they only expect that with respect to
submitting bug reports. i.e. if you are running the latest 7.x and want to
report a bug, first validate that it is still a bug in the latest 8.x
release, because if it isn't, the bug has already been identified and
patched.
The last 7.x release is super stable, but it doesn't have and won't get
some of the awesome new features going into 8.x. But if you want "stable"
you won't want to use them yet anyway. However, security fixes and bug
fixes go into the current major release. There is no parallel code base
maintenance, it's just a continuous singular stream. Therefore, a "solid"
strategy to stand still at the last prior major version is probably a bad
idea: bugs won't get patched and worse security holes will forever be
security holes.
TL;DR I *think* everyone would agree to always use the most current
release of the current major. Just "follow the rules" and avoid
experimental.
I would like to get clarification tho on mid-major deprecation removals.
If you keep your production systems always running the latest release and
then deprecations occur before your production code has had a chance to
pass through your org's process, that could be bad news.

Post by Ganesh Udupa

Post by Stefan Adams
Define "stable". The latest release is stable in that it works well and
passes all tests (thousands of them). It's not "stable" in the sense that
the 8.0 release is constantly changing and improving from minor release to
minor release, but that should be expected.
The core team works very hard to not include any breaking changes within
a major version code base, and their excellent tests help validate that.
Watch the change log. They label new things that aren't "stable" in terms
of API or even longevity as experimental and production deployments are
encouraged to avoid those features. Things that will be removed in a future
major version are labeled as deprecated.
Hmm... One thing: I think I recall that deprecations can occur within a
time frame (3 months IIRC) as opposed to being limited to at the next major
release. Don't quote me on that. If that were the case, using the last
release of the prior major release might be the most stable? If I made that
up, you should absolutely always be able to use the most recent release of
the current major -- just avoid experimental.
Core team: my apologies if I added any unacceptable confusion.

Post by Ganesh Udupa
Hi,
We are currently at 5.28. Can someone recommend a stable latest
version to upgrade to?. Is 8.04 stable?
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

Ganesh Udupa

2018-10-24 09:31:26 UTC

Permalink

Thanks a lot Stefan and Dan. I appreciate

Post by Dan Book
Yes, there is no reason to run an older release. Yes, there is a danger to
blindly updating, it's recommended to manage all your CPAN dependencies
(not just Mojolicious) with Carton to pin versions if this is a concern.
-Dan

Post by Stefan Adams

Post by Ganesh Udupa
Thanks for the quick response. I appreciate. The reason I asked is that
I saw multiple minor updates in 8.x in a short period. ( I dont know if
this is how it was in older major versions )

In my experience this is very normal, and IMO exciting!
Is the last release of 7.x a better option (thanks for that comment) or

Post by Ganesh Udupa
should I use 8.04?

IMO and based on the feedback that I see frequently from the core Dev
team: always run the latest release. However, maybe I've drawn that
conclusion too far. Perhaps they only expect that with respect to
submitting bug reports. i.e. if you are running the latest 7.x and want to
report a bug, first validate that it is still a bug in the latest 8.x
release, because if it isn't, the bug has already been identified and
patched.
The last 7.x release is super stable, but it doesn't have and won't get
some of the awesome new features going into 8.x. But if you want "stable"
you won't want to use them yet anyway. However, security fixes and bug
fixes go into the current major release. There is no parallel code base
maintenance, it's just a continuous singular stream. Therefore, a "solid"
strategy to stand still at the last prior major version is probably a bad
idea: bugs won't get patched and worse security holes will forever be
security holes.
TL;DR I *think* everyone would agree to always use the most current
release of the current major. Just "follow the rules" and avoid
experimental.
I would like to get clarification tho on mid-major deprecation removals.
If you keep your production systems always running the latest release and
then deprecations occur before your production code has had a chance to
pass through your org's process, that could be bad news.

Post by Ganesh Udupa

Post by Stefan Adams
Define "stable". The latest release is stable in that it works well and
passes all tests (thousands of them). It's not "stable" in the sense that
the 8.0 release is constantly changing and improving from minor release to
minor release, but that should be expected.
The core team works very hard to not include any breaking changes
within a major version code base, and their excellent tests help validate
that. Watch the change log. They label new things that aren't "stable" in
terms of API or even longevity as experimental and production deployments
are encouraged to avoid those features. Things that will be removed in a
future major version are labeled as deprecated.
Hmm... One thing: I think I recall that deprecations can occur within a
time frame (3 months IIRC) as opposed to being limited to at the next major
release. Don't quote me on that. If that were the case, using the last
release of the prior major release might be the most stable? If I made that
up, you should absolutely always be able to use the most recent release of
the current major -- just avoid experimental.
Core team: my apologies if I added any unacceptable confusion.

Post by Ganesh Udupa
Hi,
We are currently at 5.28. Can someone recommend a stable latest
version to upgrade to?. Is 8.04 stable?
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
Groups "Mojolicious" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mojolicious.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.